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McPhaul, Randolph, Santa G,...anyone really up for this debate

Lord Vader

Sith Lord
Joined
May 23, 2012
Messages
3,290
I get the conference schools are stuck in a GOR agreement for several years.

My question is: If every school in the conference decided in 2017 they were moving to other conferences, how could an entity that no longer existed enforce an agreement no one is willing to abide by anymore?

What if 8 of the 10 schools walked and left KSU and ISU as the only two members of a defunct (hence non existant) Big 12?

 
The GOR is a license to manage the copyright of each school's home games. If any individual school wishes to leave the conference, they can do so under the conference by-laws. The issue is that the conference still has control of the copyright to the school's home games (think of it as a musician signing a license with a music label to distribute the songs the musician created. Michael Jackson's estate controls the copyright on the old Beatles collection, not the surviving band members or the estates of John and George).

If every school left the B12, the B12 would still exist as a legal entity. The conference would still own the licenses to distribute the copyrighted television broadcasts of the members who licensed them to the conference. The conference signed agreements with networks to broadcast copyrighted games and pay the conference for the content.

It is unlikely every school would leave. The smart move would be the last to leave. Revenues from broadcast agreements are distributed between conference members. As each successive school left the conference and the conference still had the license to market the broadcasts, the remaining schools would get more and more money until the last remaining school received $200 mil/ year regardless who they played until the GOR expired.

The key here is the conference is a legal not-for-profit entity. Its assets are the IP licenses to the copyrighted home games of 10 universities. The conference continues to exist in perpetuity. The conference assets diminish in value each week as the value of remaining copyright licenses declines. Until the license each member school granted to the legal entity that is the B12 expires, the schools do not own the rights to market their copyrights. The school either buys back the license or waits until the rights revert to the school when the license held by the B12 expires. Eventually the copyright on the games expires and they enter into the public domain.

 
That sux but thanks for the info.

In theory, if all 10 schools had another conference they wanted to join could they all sign another GOR that would expire in year 20XX(the year they all leave together)? Per ur above post, I assume no but I'm no lawyer.

I feel that none of the 10 schools will get left behind and Sec and especially PAC will need schools to get to 20, so all 10 will have a destination.

 
As far as any school leaving, the question is "Why?" As it stands, B12 schools are being paid $20mil + T3 rights fees. Any other conference would have to offer at least that, plus enough to cover exit fees. The major conferences are locked into long term tv deals, so any greener pastures are hard to see right now.

I firmly believe either technology or legislative changes will soon doom the bundling of channels that is the foundation of conference networks such as SECN. Remember, CBS didn't give any additional money to the SEC when aggy and Mizzou joined because the additional schools didn't alter the fact there are only 14 games CBS gets in that deal. Additional teams don't add real value if you don't get additional content.

Conferences used to be at 8 teams. Now we are looking at possibly 16 member conferences. Is 16 any real improvement over 2 8 team conferences with the conference champs playing each other in a first round playoff game. Not in my mind.

If bundling of sports packages with other content so non-viewers pay for content they don't want goes away, the economics of college football changes radically and it gets much more expensive for teams like Alabama and Texas to give up revenue for the benefit of smaller schools with less broadcast revenues. Don't forget Tulane was once an SEC school. In a world where each school's revenues to the conference is determined by the subscribers willing pay to see that school play, realignment is inevitable as economic interests shift.

For now, there is no real reason for radical realignment. The new playoff force realignment into 16, 18 or 20 member conferences. Economics will drive any realignment and we just haven't seen any economic changes lately that would set off any major realignment.

 
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As far as any school leaving, the question is "Why?" As it stands, B12 schools are being paid $20mil + T3 rights fees. Any other conference would have to offer at least that, plus enough to cover exit fees. The major conferences are locked into long term tv deals, so any greener pastures are hard to see right now.
I firmly believe either technology or legislative changes will soon doom the bundling of channels that is the foundation of conference networks such as SECN. Remember, CBS didn't give any additional money to the SEC when aggy and Mizzou joined because the additional schools didn't alter the fact there are only 14 games CBS gets in that deal. Additional teams don't add real value if you don't get additional content.

Conferences used to be at 8 teams. Now we are looking at possibly 16 member conferences. Is 16 any real improvement over 2 8 team conferences with the conference champs playing each other in a first round playoff game. Not in my mind.

If bundling of sports packages with other content so non-viewers pay for content they don't want goes away, the economics of college football changes radically and it gets much more expensive for teams like Alabama and Texas to give up revenue for the benefit of smaller schools with less broadcast revenues. Don't forget Tulane was once an SEC school. In a world where each school's revenues to the conference is determined by the subscribers willing pay to see that school play, realignment is inevitable as economic interests shift.

For now, there is no real reason for radical realignment. The new playoff force realignment into 16, 18 or 20 member conferences. Economics will drive any realignment and we just haven't seen any economic changes lately that would set off any major realignment.
I know this is off center from what you are speaking of, but how is the Longhorn Network doing?

 
I know this is off center from what you are speaking of, but how is the Longhorn Network doing?
Making money like a champ - therefore serving its purpose!

 
The snarky answer would be "much better than it was at 10:59 last Saturday morning." The truthful answer is that those who say don't know and those who know don't say.

You have to remember UT is in a really unique place in that Austin is the largest city in the U.S. without a pro sports franchise to share its primary media market with and the demographics of Austin are a dream for sports programming (young, college educated and somewhat sophisticated). Austin /Round Rock is also larger than San Fran (1.75 mil today) and growing quickly (projected to be 2.75 mil by 2030). The LHN was originally intended to be a 2 school vehicle to monetize T3 rights (such as what the Pac12 has developed) but ESPN took quick notice of the unique marketplace UT Austin has and they decided to take a chance on funding LHN.

In asking how LHN is doing, you have to ask "Compared to what expectations?" LHN costs Disney/ESPN about $50mil/yr all in (fees to UT and operating expenses. ESPN annual revenues are around $1.3B/yr. Why ESPN Is Worth $40 Billion As The World's Most Valuable Media Property - Forbes

So, without selling a dime in ads or receiving a dime in carriage fees, the cost of LHN to ESPN is negligible. Worst case, its a long term option. My guess is that it is probably close to breaking even on an operating basis. Consider the value of the opportunity to learn lessons that they can leveraged in setting up SECN, the opportunity to train young technical and on air staff (Sam Ponder seems to have benefited from her time at LHN ) and the ability to work out operational issues they will need to have down for SECN, the cost of LHN is small. My sneaking suspicion is that ESPN Deportes will find more than a few key personnel shifted from Bristol to Austin over time. One thing that has been hugely interesting is how wealthy Mexican businessmen have been buying homes in gated communities between San Antonio and Austin over the past 10 years and having their families live safely in these houses while the men do business in Mexico.

Austin is going to be an incredible city to have an individual sports network in moving forward. Over time, they will work out content (If the University gets a world class sports medicine and orthopedics facility in the new on campus hospital, think of the athletes from both the U.S. and Latin American who will be in Austin to train and rehab. Talk about some interesting content for ESPN...). For now, whatever drain there is isn't material. I think they see value in being in Austin, they are probably at least close to breaking even on an operating basis and LHN fees they pay to UT are a sunk cost. Their presence in Austin is worth the cost of how they got there and I think they are smart enough to make money for ESPN because of the deal, even if it doesn't flow through the LHN balance sheet.

All in all, no one at ESPN is losing sleep over their presence in Austin or the cost of maintaining their facilities there. In fact, i think some younger guns are licking their chops to show what they can do with the LHN asset.

 
I asked a simple question and got greatness. RD, you are fast becoming a favorite.

"I am not worthy."

notworthyo.gif


 
The snarky answer would be "much better than it was at 10:59 last Saturday morning." The truthful answer is that those who say don't know and those who know don't say.
You have to remember UT is in a really unique place in that Austin is the largest city in the U.S. without a pro sports franchise to share its primary media market with and the demographics of Austin are a dream for sports programming (young, college educated and somewhat sophisticated). Austin /Round Rock is also larger than San Fran (1.75 mil today) and growing quickly (projected to be 2.75 mil by 2030). The LHN was originally intended to be a 2 school vehicle to monetize T3 rights (such as what the Pac12 has developed) but ESPN took quick notice of the unique marketplace UT Austin has and they decided to take a chance on funding LHN.

In asking how LHN is doing, you have to ask "Compared to what expectations?" LHN costs Disney/ESPN about $50mil/yr all in (fees to UT and operating expenses. ESPN annual revenues are around $1.3B/yr. Why ESPN Is Worth $40 Billion As The World's Most Valuable Media Property - Forbes

So, without selling a dime in ads or receiving a dime in carriage fees, the cost of LHN to ESPN is negligible. Worst case, its a long term option. My guess is that it is probably close to breaking even on an operating basis. Consider the value of the opportunity to learn lessons that they can leveraged in setting up SECN, the opportunity to train young technical and on air staff (Sam Ponder seems to have benefited from her time at LHN ) and the ability to work out operational issues they will need to have down for SECN, the cost of LHN is small. My sneaking suspicion is that ESPN Deportes will find more than a few key personnel shifted from Bristol to Austin over time. One thing that has been hugely interesting is how wealthy Mexican businessmen have been buying homes in gated communities between San Antonio and Austin over the past 10 years and having their families live safely in these houses while the men do business in Mexico.

Austin is going to be an incredible city to have an individual sports network in moving forward. Over time, they will work out content (If the University gets a world class sports medicine and orthopedics facility in the new on campus hospital, think of the athletes from both the U.S. and Latin American who will be in Austin to train and rehab. Talk about some interesting content for ESPN...). For now, whatever drain there is isn't material. I think they see value in being in Austin, they are probably at least close to breaking even on an operating basis and LHN fees they pay to UT are a sunk cost. Their presence in Austin is worth the cost of how they got there and I think they are smart enough to make money for ESPN because of the deal, even if it doesn't flow through the LHN balance sheet.

All in all, no one at ESPN is losing sleep over their presence in Austin or the cost of maintaining their facilities there. In fact, i think some younger guns are licking their chops to show what they can do with the LHN asset.
And if i understand correctly this is a major reasoning, why Luck would be a great hire for new AD. We as alum and fans tend to use emotion first, and overlook the business side of the program. Always a great read Mr.Duke. Thanks for bringing that perspective into play.

 
Did u have to use a watermarked stock photo for your hanging pic? Sheesh.

 
Did u have to use a watermarked stock photo for your hanging pic? Sheesh.
you try finding one thats not of some dude from the Middle east beat to a pulp. Still trying to keep this at least Rated R around here

 
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