Conference Realignment Discussion

[Baron]

For geographic reasons and rivalries WV would much prefer the ACC or the SEC.  Obviously they are too small of a market for the SEC. 

I'm sure WV reached out to the ACC when TX and OU announced they were heading to the SEC. Obviously the ACC turned them down,  just like they did before they joined the BIG12. No reason to believe anything has changed.

I'm thinking the ACC told WVU that they were standing pat 11 months ago. Things have changed now. 

 

[Wayne]

WVU is perfect for the ACC

If the ACC gets desperate.  WVU doesn’t bring eyeballs and they don’t have the academics that the ACC likes. They just don’t bring anything to the ACC unless Clemson, FSU, and some others leave. 

 

[Baron]

If the ACC gets desperate.  WVU doesn’t bring eyeballs and they don’t have the academics that the ACC likes. They just don’t bring anything to the ACC unless Clemson, FSU, and some others leave. 

Gotta disagree. It's not about academics anymore. They've had fewer losing seasons than Texas in the last 12 years. Their arrival to the ACC would also start two natural rivalries.

 

[dssl]

I'm thinking the ACC told WVU that they were standing pat 11 months ago. Things have changed now. 

Some people think 16 or bigger is important these days because the SEC and the B1G are going to 16. i don't agree,  IMHO the SEC and BiG expanded because they thought it would help the leagues teams get more money.

The BIG12 expanded for a very different reason. They thought they needed more competition to secure their position as a P5 league , and so they had to overlook the fact that 3 of the new teams are bad for the per team bottom line.

The ACC doesn't have any expansion targets(besides Notre Dame) that would improve the per team payout,  and they are in no danger of losing their P5 status. So I don't know why you think "Things have changed now"?

 

[Wayne]

Gotta disagree. It's not about academics anymore. They've had fewer losing seasons than Texas in the last 12 years. Their arrival to the ACC would also start two natural rivalries.

But people watch Texas. Maybe to do the horns down at the TV but they watch. Nobody watches WVU. They will bring down the payout because the ratings of ACC games would go down. 
 

The only way WVU gets in a better conference is for that conference to lose better teams. They might get in the ACC if FSU, Clemson, NC, and Miami join the SEC or Big 10. 
 

They bring nothing to the table. 

 

[Eastexhorn]

Guess they go to bed hungry.

 

[Sirhornsalot]

But people watch Texas. Maybe to do the horns down at the TV but they watch. Nobody watches WVU. They will bring down the payout because the ratings of ACC games would go down. 
 

The only way WVU gets in a better conference is for that conference to lose better teams. They might get in the ACC if FSU, Clemson, NC, and Miami join the SEC or Big 10. 
 

They bring nothing to the table. 

Because of the ACC's grant of rights agreement, those teams splitting off is almost impossible. Thats the problem with the idea of the SEC poaching the ACC. SEC is pretty happy with the way things are right now. They don't see bigger as being better.

ACC can add teams, such as ND should they decide to join. However, I tend to think ND would instead go Big10 because they will be one of the two major conferences.

We're about to have a three-tiered system in college football.

 

[Wayne]

Because of the ACC's grant of rights agreement, those teams splitting off is almost impossible. Thats the problem with the idea of the SEC poaching the ACC. SEC is pretty happy with the way things are right now. They don't see bigger as being better.

ACC can add teams, such as ND should they decide to join. However, I tend to think ND would instead go Big10 because they will be one of the two major conferences.

We're about to have a three-tiered system in college football.

If the Big 10 adds Washington, Oregon, Stanford and Notre Dame. And that’s not outside the realm of possibility. The SEC will do something. The SEC won’t be so happy then. They’ll look to expand. They’ll want FSU, Clemson, NC and Miami. 

 

[Baron]

But people watch Texas. Maybe to do the horns down at the TV but they watch. Nobody watches WVU. They will bring down the payout because the ratings of ACC games would go down. 
 

The only way WVU gets in a better conference is for that conference to lose better teams. They might get in the ACC if FSU, Clemson, NC, and Miami join the SEC or Big 10. 
 

They bring nothing to the table. 

Did you think that USC and UCLA would bolt to the B1G last week? Things are changing faster than most of us can keep up with.

 

[Wayne]

Did you think that USC and UCLA would bolt to the B1G last week? Things are changing faster than most of us can keep up with.

If I knew the Big 10 wanted them I would have thought they would go last week.  Right now there are 30 million reasons a year to go. But under the Big 10 contract that starts in 2025, it becomes 70m a year by the end of the decade. Big 10 schools will be getting 100m plus a year. The PAC 12 now pays 32m a year. 

 

[dssl]

If I knew the Big 10 wanted them I would have thought they would go last week.  Right now there are 30 million reasons a year to go. But under the Big 10 contract that starts in 2025, it becomes 70m a year by the end of the decade. Big 10 schools will be getting 100m plus a year. The PAC 12 now pays 32m a year. 

Exactly.  The bottom line is schools like TX and I guess USC as well, pull in allot more revenue from the conference then they recieve, so there is an incentive for both the the marquee programs and the marquee conferences for the move.

For TX the move also made sense regionally and rivalry wise,  for USC regionally it's not a fit and rivalries not great,  but apparently that's less important then money,  which may be required to stay competitive in the long run.

 

[Wayne]

Exactly.  The bottom line is schools like TX and I guess USC as well, pull in allot more revenue from the conference then they recieve, so there is an incentive for both the the marquee programs and the marquee conferences for the move.

For TX the move also made sense regionally and rivalry wise,  for USC regionally it's not a fit and rivalries not great,  but apparently that's less important then money,  which may be required to stay competitive in the long run.

With both USC and UCLA in the Big 10 that rivalry can become important. UCLA should be able to recruit better as a member of the Big 10. The Big 10 is trying to get Notre Dame. If they do the USC Notre Dame rivalry become yearly. 

 

[dssl]

With both USC and UCLA in the Big 10 that rivalry can become important. UCLA should be able to recruit better as a member of the Big 10. The Big 10 is trying to get Notre Dame. If they do the USC Notre Dame rivalry become yearly. 

Even if Notre Dame stays independent there is nothing stopping an annual USC match up. What they lose is there other PAC rivalries. 

Some new rivalries will likely form over time. I think the bigger issues are travel distances and time zones.

 

[lshorn79]

22 hours ago, longhorn_mig said:

What?  No invitation for Colorado?  ?

 

[Wayne]

Even if Notre Dame stays independent there is nothing stopping an annual USC match up. What they lose is there other PAC rivalries. 

Some new rivalries will likely form over time. I think the bigger issues are travel distances and time zones.

If Notre Dame doesn’t join the Big 10 or SEC, they may not get to play their rivals. There’s a chance that if the Power 2 conferences expand to 9 games, there’s less interest in playing Notre Dame every year because a loss may cost you a playoff spot. The squeeze is going to be applied to Notre Dame.
 

Notre Dame is going to fall behind in football because there’s no network that’s going to give them $100M a year for 5 or six home games.  

 

[dssl]

If Notre Dame doesn’t join the Big 10 or SEC, they may not get to play their rivals. There’s a chance that if the Power 2 conferences expand to 9 games, there’s less interest in playing Notre Dame every year because a loss may cost you a playoff spot. The squeeze is going to be applied to Notre Dame.
 

Notre Dame is going to fall behind in football because there’s no network that’s going to give them $100M a year for 5 or six home games.  

I would think a 16 team conference is likely to have a 9 game conference schedule which still leaves 3 non conference games, which shouldn't create any ND scheduling issues. Definitely some teams like to play an easy non conference schedule,  but it's not clear to me that the rescent changes will make it harder for Notre Dame to put together a compelling schedule. 

If a conference gets bigger then 16 it could end up with 10 or 11 conference games at which point it could be more of a problem for Notre Dame schedulers. 

 

[Sirhornsalot]

Exactly.  The bottom line is schools like TX and I guess USC as well, pull in allot more revenue from the conference then they recieve, so there is an incentive for both the the marquee programs and the marquee conferences for the move.

For TX the move also made sense regionally and rivalry wise,  for USC regionally it's not a fit and rivalries not great,  but apparently that's less important then money,  which may be required to stay competitive in the long run.

Are you talking about income or expenses?

Imagine the expenses involved in sending all of your teams in all sports across the country several times a season?

Yeah, they'll make more. But they'll also spend much more. And will the athletes be able to cope with all that travel time, all the time?

 

[dssl]

Are you talking about income or expenses?

Imagine the expenses involved in sending all of your teams in all sports across the country several times a season?

Yeah, they'll make more. But they'll also spend much more. And will the athletes be able to cope with all that travel time, all the time?

I definitely was only thinking about the gross income, not the net. Obviously the net is harder to figure out, although I would assume that they understood those numbers before making the decision.  I definitely agree that geography is a big problem for the USC and UCLA.

 

[oldhorn2]

I dont think Notre Dame could continue as an independent in an era of super conferences. I think they would get fewer marquee opponents than now and if that doesnt start cutting into revenue it will certainly effect recruiting.

just my opinion

 

[Wayne]

Are you talking about income or expenses?

Imagine the expenses involved in sending all of your teams in all sports across the country several times a season?

Yeah, they'll make more. But they'll also spend much more. And will the athletes be able to cope with all that travel time, all the time?

If you are USC/UCLA and you cover your current expense on $32M of conference revenue a year for all sports. You can cover any additional cost on the extra $70M a year you get. Then you can reinvest in facilities and coaches to keep up with the Power 2 teams. 
 

If you don’t join the Power 2, you will fall $70M a year behind those schools. The road trips in the PAC 12 are already long for the teams.