24/7's Elite 11 evaluations

[echeese]

Shea Patterson was the MVP of the Elite 11 per Trent Dilfer.

Here is how 24/7 broke things down.

BEAVERTON, Ore. – Following the completion of the Elite 11 and The Opening, the Elite 11 staff will release the final Elite 11 for the class of 2016. But we've got our own opinion. Below we rank our top 11 passers according to 247Sports based strictly on this week's body of work.

1. Shea Patterson (Ole Miss commit) – Patterson's team lost their first four games and if not for a three-overtime win in the playoffs, the Lunar Beast team would have gone 0-5. But Patterson is the reason that they didn't go 0-5 and he's the reason they made a championship run. You could feel the Ole Miss commit getting into a rhythm and once that happened, no one else really had a chance.

2. Malik Henry (Florida State commit) – Henry was consistently one of the best quarterbacks in attendance throughout the week, spinning it well, throwing crisp decisive balls and then his team went undefeated in the playoffs to make the championship game.

3. Dwayne Haskins (Maryland commit) – Haskins didn't have a lot of room for error because a lot of his receivers were smaller but he was slicing up defenses with precision and they made him look good with yards after the catch. We've always thought he had a case for the best pure thrower in this class and he made another strong argument in Oregon.

4. KJ Costello (Stanford commit) – Costello had some ups and downs just like all quarterbacks did but his highs were much more frequent and he looked as dialed in and focused as any quarterback at the event. His connection with Tyler Vaughns and Kaden Smith were tough to stop.

5. Shane Buechele (Texas commit) – Through the first half of the week, Buechele was the most accurate quarterback on air. He continued that steady play throughout tournament play and earned enough trust from his coaching staff to essentially take the starting job uncontested throughout the tournament. Buechele earned opportunity through the first half of the week and capitalized during 7on7 play.

6. Jacob Eason (Georgia commit) – We felt like Eason was the most talented quarterback in attendance but he got very limited opportunity to play in the 7on7 tournament because of his team's decision to ride Buechele. Every time Eason was on the field, he flashed that elite ability but many observers – including us – were disappointed we couldn't see more of it.

7. Brandon Peters (Michigan commit) – Peters is one of the best quarterbacks in the Elite 11 from release to completion. The ball is always on target with spin and velocity. If he picks up the pace in his drops and delivery, adds some more urgency, he has a chance to be one of the best quarterbacks in this group.

8. Feleipe Franks (LSU commit) – When he was under center, Franks was the type of quarterback that could make a 99th percentile throw on three throws and then skip one on his fourth. He continues to be an upside guy that is inching closer and closer to that ceiling. We think he took a step forward this week.

9. Brandon McIlwain (South Carolina commit) – Though he was never able to put it together for a consistent playoff run, McIlwain was close throughout the week and like Franks, he's always moving in the right direction from a developmental standpoint.

10. Jawon Pass (Uncommitted) – It's a pleasant surprise to see Pass sneak into this top 11 because early in the week he looked like he was a tier below as a passer from some of the other arms in attendance. But every day Pass gained confidence and every day he looked more comfortable. When he got his opportunities in tournament play, Pass looked like he belonged.

11. Anthony Russo (Rutgers commit) – We could easily put Jett Duffey in this spot because the Texas Tech commit had a really consistent week but Russo's emergence needs to be noted. He took some lumps during tournament play but he also had some really big moments where he showed touch, precision and second level accuracy. Russo will be a guy to keep an eye on as a senior.

 

[utisdabomb12]

Shea Patterson was the MVP of the Elite 11 per Trent Dilfer.

Here is how 24/7 broke things down.

BEAVERTON, Ore. – Following the completion of the Elite 11 and The Opening, the Elite 11 staff will release the final Elite 11 for the class of 2016. But we've got our own opinion. Below we rank our top 11 passers according to 247Sports based strictly on this week's body of work.

1. Shea Patterson (Ole Miss commit) – Patterson's team lost their first four games and if not for a three-overtime win in the playoffs, the Lunar Beast team would have gone 0-5. But Patterson is the reason that they didn't go 0-5 and he's the reason they made a championship run. You could feel the Ole Miss commit getting into a rhythm and once that happened, no one else really had a chance.

2. Malik Henry (Florida State commit) – Henry was consistently one of the best quarterbacks in attendance throughout the week, spinning it well, throwing crisp decisive balls and then his team went undefeated in the playoffs to make the championship game.

3. Dwayne Haskins (Maryland commit) – Haskins didn't have a lot of room for error because a lot of his receivers were smaller but he was slicing up defenses with precision and they made him look good with yards after the catch. We've always thought he had a case for the best pure thrower in this class and he made another strong argument in Oregon.

4. KJ Costello (Stanford commit) – Costello had some ups and downs just like all quarterbacks did but his highs were much more frequent and he looked as dialed in and focused as any quarterback at the event. His connection with Tyler Vaughns and Kaden Smith were tough to stop.

5. Shane Buechele (Texas commit) – Through the first half of the week, Buechele was the most accurate quarterback on air. He continued that steady play throughout tournament play and earned enough trust from his coaching staff to essentially take the starting job uncontested throughout the tournament. Buechele earned opportunity through the first half of the week and capitalized during 7on7 play.

6. Jacob Eason (Georgia commit) – We felt like Eason was the most talented quarterback in attendance but he got very limited opportunity to play in the 7on7 tournament because of his team's decision to ride Buechele. Every time Eason was on the field, he flashed that elite ability but many observers – including us – were disappointed we couldn't see more of it.

7. Brandon Peters (Michigan commit) – Peters is one of the best quarterbacks in the Elite 11 from release to completion. The ball is always on target with spin and velocity. If he picks up the pace in his drops and delivery, adds some more urgency, he has a chance to be one of the best quarterbacks in this group.

8. Feleipe Franks (LSU commit) – When he was under center, Franks was the type of quarterback that could make a 99th percentile throw on three throws and then skip one on his fourth. He continues to be an upside guy that is inching closer and closer to that ceiling. We think he took a step forward this week.

9. Brandon McIlwain (South Carolina commit) – Though he was never able to put it together for a consistent playoff run, McIlwain was close throughout the week and like Franks, he's always moving in the right direction from a developmental standpoint.

10. Jawon Pass (Uncommitted) – It's a pleasant surprise to see Pass sneak into this top 11 because early in the week he looked like he was a tier below as a passer from some of the other arms in attendance. But every day Pass gained confidence and every day he looked more comfortable. When he got his opportunities in tournament play, Pass looked like he belonged.

11. Anthony Russo (Rutgers commit) – We could easily put Jett Duffey in this spot because the Texas Tech commit had a really consistent week but Russo's emergence needs to be noted. He took some lumps during tournament play but he also had some really big moments where he showed touch, precision and second level accuracy. Russo will be a guy to keep an eye on as a senior.

I've been a 247 fan but after the Elite 11/Opening I'm reevaluating that. So much confirmation bias and inability to reevaluate their rankings. Barton Simmons has his favorite QBs and nothing on the field is going to change his evaluations. Hell, he reluctantly ranks Buechele above Eason only because "the team's decision to ride with Buechele." Ummm maybe because Buechele was a substantially better QB at the camp is why the team rode with him.

A great example of this confirmation bias and attempt to justify their rankings is Jawon Pass. From what I've read and heard, Jawon Pass was arguably the worst QB at the camp. Somehow he ends up ranked in the top 10 according to 247. Confirmation bias is a hell of thing. A few of the 247 guys really hyped Jawon Pass early and everyone at that network ran with it. Now they've almost rationalized that he's a great player when his play has been pretty terrible right in front of their eyes. 

247's coverage at the Elite 11 was terrible, absolutely terrible. This is why I tell people to take recruiting rankings with a grain of salt.  Done with rant.

Thanks for the article though. 

 

[Agmaniacmike]

I have a hard time judging other sites' evaluations when I wasn't there for the competition. Bitching and complaining about another person's criteria for a football contest played in shorts seems misdirected and petty. For all of the criticism involving certain sites, you sure don't mind posting their info and likely subcribing to their website. Buechele looked tired and lacked accuracy this morning at state 7-on-7, but I'm not going to let his one performance in which other factors played a negative part in his performance affect my view on him. 

 

[utisdabomb12]

I have a hard time judging other sites' evaluations when I wasn't there for the competition. Bitching and complaining about another person's criteria for a football contest played in shorts seems misdirected and petty. For all of the criticism involving certain sites, you sure don't mind posting their info and likely subcribing to their website. Buechele looked tired and lacked accuracy this morning at state 7-on-7, but I'm not going to let his one performance in which other factors played a negative part in his performance affect my view on him. 

1-I'm not a subscriber to 247.

2- I post info from all the sites (scout, 247, ESPN, and rivals). I give due credit to those that do a good job, and criticize those that don't. Matter of fact, I've given a ton of credit to the Longhorn 247 site for their coverage on Buechele. 

3-"Bitching and complaining about another person's criteria" entirely misses the point. The entire point of the post was that 247 has favorites and they are going to stick with those favorites regardless of play on the field. It has nothing to do with talent evaluation or "criteria".

4-This isn't even about Buechele so I'm not sure why you are using language like "petty", but you are an aggie so whatever.

5-I provided examples that back up confirmation bias at 247. 247, including Simmons, have been over hyping Pass for months. This is a guy that's performed terrible at several camps, and based on the reviews from other sites he didn't perform well at the Elite 11. You are right, I wasn't present at the Elite 11, but that doesn't mean I can't reach conclusions based on info from other sites. So yeah, based on what I've read from other sites Pass being ranked in the top 10 is laughably bad. Granted, not all that surprising because 247 has been hyping him for months. You made a subjective claim where I actually used players from the Elite 11 that prove confirmation bias at 247. The same can be said for Eason. 

6-I stand by what I said. 247's coverage at the Elite 11 was terrible. That's not to say everyone at the 247 network were terrible. I thought guys like EJ Holland did an excellent job. Like I said above, this is why I take recruiting rankings with a grain of salt. They are often not based on "criteria" from on the field play but reinforced biases. Barton Simmons is probably one of the best in the business when it comes to inside info on recruiting, but I don't take his recruiting rankings seriously at all (that was only reinforced this weekend). IMO every other major site, including ESPN/Rivals/Scout, had much more objective evaluations/coverage at the Elite 11. 

 

[primal defense]

While I was rooting for Shane to be MVP, I've seen and read enough to know that we have one of the top QBs if not the best 2016 QB in the country. I'm looking forward to following Shane's senior season.

My personal honorable mention: Shane Buechele, QB

How good was Shane Buechele this week? Jacob Eason entered camp as the 247Sports' No. 1 prospect nationally, but he was relegated to back-up duties behind Buechele in the 7-on-7 tournament.

The 6-foot-1, 190-pound quarterback was a gamer in every competition and led his team to the semifinals.

http://www.oregonlive.com/recruiting/index.ssf/2015/07/the_opening_awards_wr_kyle_dav.html

 

[utisdabomb12]

While I was rooting for Shane to be MVP, I've seen and read enough to know that we have one of the top QBs if not the best 2016 QB in the country. I'm looking forward to following Shane's senior season.

My personal honorable mention: Shane Buechele, QB

How good was Shane Buechele this week? Jacob Eason entered camp as the 247Sports' No. 1 prospect nationally, but he was relegated to back-up duties behind Buechele in the 7-on-7 tournament.

The 6-foot-1, 190-pound quarterback was a gamer in every competition and led his team to the semifinals.

http://www.oregonlive.com/recruiting/index.ssf/2015/07/the_opening_awards_wr_kyle_dav.html

My personal honorable mention: Shane Buechele, QB

How good was Shane Buechele this week? Jacob Eason entered camp as the 247Sports' No. 1 prospect nationally, but he was relegated to back-up duties behind Buechele in the 7-on-7 tournament.

The 6-foot-1, 190-pound quarterback was a gamer in every competition and led his team to the semifinals.

The best thing is I think he has some hype now with other players. That can only help in recruiting. 

 

[joeywa]

IMHO, joeywa's coverage of the Elite 11/The Opening was far superior to 247's.....and that was armed only with an iPhone and no media credential.

 

[utisdabomb12]

IMHO, joeywa's coverage of the Elite 11/The Opening was far superior to 247's.....and that was armed only with an iPhone and no media credential.

LMAO, in all seriousness I appreciated your comments and coverage because it wasn't biased about Buechele. Stuff about having hesitation on checking down to WRs was good insight. 

 

[Agmaniacmike]

I have an issue with you justifying your positions on confirmation bias from one site by using info from another site. Your observations about Pass aren't developed from any personal experience, so they have little credence. But, since you mentioned Pass, their snippet clearly explains that they believe he sneaked into their top 11 by playing solid in the game scenarios. Eason was put 6th, despite being 1st in their QB rankings, hardly a biased selection and that ranking doesn't exactly fit their pre-combine expectations for him. The only bias here is you making up your mind on two recruits based off of others' observations. I don't understand your constant need to berate media figures based off of claims you have little factual basis to back up. You questioned Barton Simmons' character when you have no personal evaluation to judge from. No surprise though, from someone who has little intent on putting a face to the name that continues to stir up negative claims about others. 

Michael Marek Class of 2012

 

[echeese]

IMHO, joeywa's coverage of the Elite 11/The Opening was far superior to 247's.....and that was armed only with an iPhone and no media credential.

Hmmmm,

Didn't get the newsletter. . . 

I think you are making this shit up because you are a whore for "likes". . . . 

 

 

[utisdabomb12]

I have an issue with you justifying your positions on confirmation bias from one site by using info from another site.

That's fair. I wasn't present at Elite 11 and don't get to see a lot of players live, so a lot of what I say has a certain level of confirmation bias. At the end of the day, I'm not ranking players so my confirmation bias has little to no impact. 

Your observations about Pass aren't developed from any personal experience, so they have little credence.

If you do a little amount of research you will find out that Pass is more of a runner and a very inconsistent passer. He's a good player, but not a top 150 type player in the country. Alabama and Auburn were heavy leaders for Pass early in his recruitment, now it's Louisville. Want to know why, both teams learned he can't throw the ball so they backed off him. 

Eason was put 6th, despite being 1st in their QB rankings, hardly a biased selection and that ranking doesn't exactly fit their pre-combine expectations for him.

Simmons pretty much admits he couldn't place Eason higher because he was benched in favor of Buechele. If Eason played more Simmons would have had him in the top 3. Guarantee it. 

I don't understand your constant need to berate media figures based off of claims you have little factual basis to back up.

Who have I "berated"? Only 2 that come to my mind are Chip Brown and Barton Simmons. I guess you could also say Taylor Hamm and Liucci, but those 2 are terrible. If you've followed my twitter you would know that I've been very complimentary to several people covering the Elite 11. Matter of fact, if you were on Shaggy I'm quick to compliment Hornsports even when there's heavy criticism at times because of McPhaul. When I criticize someone like Chip Brown and Barton Simmons, I back it up with examples for why the criticism exists. I disagree with a couple people that are recruiting analysts, sorry that bothers you so much. If you are going to call me out for "berating media figures" at least provide some evidence. All you've done so far is shown you have a personal issue with me with really no evidence at all to back up your claims. I guess questioning analysts recruiting rankings = "berating", who knew? It's not like I said Simmons is a murderer, I said he has favorites and that impacts his recruiting rankings. 

You questioned Barton Simmons' character when you have no personal evaluation to judge from. No surprise though, from someone who has little intent on putting a face to the name that continues to stir up negative claims about others. 

You seem a little worked up.  Feel free to criticize anything I say, I don't get worked up over this stuff. I stand by what I said, Barton Simmons' coverage at the Elite 11 was a joke. I'm sure not going to give out my personal information to a random aggie after your "cult" attempted to stalk randolph duke. Sorry, but not really.  If you don't like what I have to say just ignore me aggie. I will continue to criticize people that I think deserve the criticism. Which has really only been Chip Brown and Barton Simmons out of all the recruiting analysts. 

 

[utisdabomb12]

http://texas.247sports.com/Board/21/Contents/Mods-should-be-embarrassed-38155115

Here's a long thread over at 247 where several people have the same opinion as me. But hey, I'm apparently "berating a media member" because I disagree with his coverage. Hell, several posters even use the same language I did like "confirmation bias". You would have an argument if I was pulling things out of thin air, Simmons deserves the criticism. 

I'm going to guess the 27 likes for the thread proves there were quite a few people disappointed with 247/Barton Simmons. 

 

[Agmaniacmike]

Did you just use a Texas 247 thread complaining that Buechele wasn't #1 and calling it "shameful" as a way to prove your point?

Nationally there were arguments about Eason, Guarantano, and other participants over the 247 boards this week, but Simmons' name wasn't trashed by most unbiased observers.

There is an inherent bias amongst the 247 subscribers to defend the QBs committed to their schools. A&M fans did it the last few years for Murray and Allen, Georgia did it for Eason this year, etc. There isn't anything wrong with defending your guy, even if you have no evidence to prove that his performance was superior to the competition other than hearsay. The issue becomes when you start throwing out theories that discredit somebody's professional nature.

The fact that multiple posters blurted out SEC bias in response to an Elite 11 competition to me is both baffling and unremarkably sad.

By your logic, I could go to the Horn Meltdown Thread on Texas, post "Buechele sucks", and get 1000 likes. Obviously that means Buechele is a supbar QB and everybody must feel this way.

 

[utisdabomb12]

Did you just use a Texas 247 thread complaining that Buechele wasn't #1 and calling it "shameful" as a way to prove your point?

What? I have no clue what you are saying? I used the thread as a point of reference to show that several people weren't happy with Simmons because of some of the things I explained above, like confirmation bias. 

Nationally there were arguments about Eason, Guarantano, and other participants over the 247 boards this week, but Simmons' name wasn't trashed by most unbiased observers.

Trashed? I said I disagreed with him because he has favorites that distort his rankings regardless of play on the field. You act like I called the guy a liar, racist or murderer.  Not once have I questioned his "character". For all I know he's a good dude, I just disagree with how does things. Calm down. 

There is an inherent bias amongst the 247 subscribers to defend the QBs committed to their schools. A&M fans did it the last few years for Murray and Allen, Georgia did it for Eason this year, etc. There isn't anything wrong with defending your guy, even if you have no evidence to prove that his performance was superior to the competition other than hearsay. The issue becomes when you start throwing out theories that discredit somebody's professional nature.

My arguments above have nothing to do with Buechele. I think Buechele probably deserved to win based on his performance throughout the week, but I have no problem with Patterson winning the the Elite 11. I've said for months I think Patterson is the best QB in the country and he performed well in 7 v 7. That's why I used examples of Pass and Eason. My criticism of Simmons goes beyond just Buechele being ranked 5th, and goes beyond just the Elite 11. I said this would happen on Shaggy even before the Elite 11 started, and I was correct. It is what it is, Simmons has favorites and you aren't going to change his mind on who the best QBs are in the country. 

By your logic, I could go to the Horn Meltdown Thread on Texas, post "Buechele sucks", and get 1000 likes. Obviously that means Buechele is a supbar QB and everybody must feel this way.

It's like you totally missed the point. The likes weren't simply because Buechele was ranked 5th, it was because posters were disappointed with inherent biases guys like Simmons have. That's why you even saw posters talking about ending their subscription because of "confirmation bias".  Maybe some of the likes were simply because Buechele was ranked #5, but I bet a good bit came from the points I explained above. 

 

[MikeV73]

Who cares in the long run, to each their own. Let's not get bent out of shape regarding one persons opinions vs another's. I do know all of these sites want clicks and dollars so they have agendas. That doesn't mean they don't have the ability to evaluate talent. Now I will go back to watching Shark Week which is much more productive than arguing the merits of talent evaluation by a bunch of dudes who probably were yearbook staff members instead of athletes.

 

[joeywa]

Hmmmm,

Didn't get the newsletter. . .

I think you are making this shit up because you are a whore for "likes". . . .

Just to help you locate the newsletter:

http://www.hornsports.com/forums/topic/10355-the-opening-thursday-w-buechele-pics/